paulg: this is a "Play a Hand with the Expert" session for the Beginners/Intermediates Lounge paulg: non-BIL members are welcome to attend ... Pilar2000: i don t see anything! help paulg: but my biggest request is that people contribute!! ->Pilar2000: nothing to see yet! Pilar2000: ty paulg: we will step through a hand paulg: and I will ask what you would do at this point ... paulg: and I'd like you to comment .... paulg: we will then look at the actions that I might choose, and why .. dwbva: send comments to you or to room? paulg: you will find it easiest if you expand the window to the maximum ... ->dwbva: comments to room paulg: please send your comments to the room rather than directly to me ... paulg: this is all for fun ... not to embarrass anyone :) paulg: so, we are playing IMPs, that is teams ... paulg: Everyone is VULNERABLE - Game ALL ... babog: we blush in the privacy of our own homes lol Pilar2000: lol paulg: Game All is called "red vs red" in the US, and "amber" in the UK paulg: we are sitting South ... paulg: And it is our opening bid .... paulg: so what you do you consider opening ?? sceptic: 2!h lonedar: 1 h verg: 2!h LoveBrdge: 2h sallyally: 2 !H babog: 2!H 1Valeria: 2!H panim: 2h gremlin: 2!H Pilar2000: 2h drgarie: 2!h paulg: ok, most of us wish to open 2!h ... this seems very reasonable paulg: no-one suggested 3!h ... paulg: which I might open if non-vulnerable panim: why paulg: 1!h would work if your partner likes very weak openers paulg: i'd open 3!h non-vulnerable because this looks like a 7 card suit to me paulg: And I only have one spade paulg: so what does the auction tells us? lonedar: east has opening hand sceptic: west does not have good spades and p has less than 14 hcp panim: points are in east panim: and spades babog: wants p to bid verg: East has good !h 1Valeria: partner may have other suit as he has not prempt raise sceptic: east has short hearts and all 3 other suits covered paulg: so we know that partner does not have the values to invite game .... paulg: also partner does not want to raise hearts ... paulg: so probably does not have a weak hand AND hearts paulg: otherwise he would preempt paulg: East's double is takeout .... Blanca17: doesnt it mean that p does not have open points? paulg: Partner could have opening points with no heart support ... Blanca17: sorry, im one that blushes lol ->Blanca17: np ->Blanca17: good question otherwise I wouldn't respond in public paulg: so is East's double the same as if West had doubled? Blanca17: ))) 1Valeria: no dwbva: no, it's in balancing seat paulg: correct, east's double may be weaker in the balancing seat sceptic: no balancing seat can be a king light paulg: well done, wayne recalling an earlier session :) paulg: so East may, or may not, have opening values ... but is probably short in hearts paulg: so what is going on? isabable: not sure whay is k light ty dwbva: west probably has five hearts ->isabable: in balancing seat, like East here, you can bid with 3 points less than normal sceptic: passed for penalties isabable: ty babog: penalty X paulg: ok, so it looks like West has good hearts .... paulg: West may have a good hand too .... which would be bad :) paulg: anyhow, we are now playing the contract in 2!h-Doubled paulg: West leads the !c3 .... and this is what you see ... paulg: so, we know that West holds Kxxxx(x) for his pass paulg: what do you make of the !c3 lead? babog: mabe from K 1Valeria: may be singleton lonedar: singleton sceptic: doubt from K, low card so ghe has prob 3 1Valeria: but it's the same I think babog: ok paulg: which tricks do you expect to make here? dwbva: if east has five clubs, his hand got weaker in hcp??? 1Valeria: few tricks paulg: east could be 4!s, 1!h, 3!d, 5!c with !sAK, !cAK sceptic: A!C paulg: yes, missed that, ok !dA too :) paulg: so it is now time to look into the expert's mind ... paulg: generally as defender, when holding long trumps, it is best to try and force declarer babog: but if he had ak !C he wouldnt play small paulg: so it would be unusual for an expert to lead a singleton against this contract paulg: so i should be safe to take the finesse paulg: so we shall play the !cQ .. paulg: and it holds! paulg: what should we lead from dummy now? 1Valeria: q!H LoveBrdge: queen of heart panim: q heart 1Valeria: for A!H and !C philuser1: ace of clubs if it's ruffed let them come nzakosek: !s sceptic: A!H then J!H LoveBrdge: then w will ruff with his singl heart paulg: so we lead the !hQ and East plays !h6 ... paulg: what do we do? panim: duck LoveBrdge: small 1Valeria: A!H babog: q !H ->nzakosek: !s does work too philuser1: no enty anymore in dummy the only chance to make ace of clubs is now paulg: so how many people have counted our tricks at this point? paulg: And worked out whether we are going to make the contract? babog: me lol 1Valeria: then !C for J!C and a!C discard !S isabable: to be honest not me paulg: As I often tell sceptic ... it is better to plan slowly and then play quickly :) LoveBrdge: ace of heart and do finess in cl and do queen of sp away paulg: rather than play quickly and then plan on every trick! sceptic: I was still trying to work my plan out :( panim: i agree with 1 valeria babog: 5 losers paulg: it looks like West holds !cKxx(x) paulg: so we can make three club tricks ... paulg: it looks difficult to make a diamond trick .... paulg: .... as we would need to guess whether the !d10 is ... paulg: .... and West may only hold two with East holding !dAK bzstvn: Could you tell a miserable latecomer (me) what the contract is? 1Valeria: and 5!H we make contract!! I was so depressed! ->bzstvn: 2!h doubled paulg: so we should aim to make 3 clubs, discarding our spade loser, and 5 hearts .... bzstvn: Ty paulg: so we must NOT take the heart finesse .... paulg: ... as we know it loses .... babog: darn! paulg: ... and we will not be able to throw our spade away paulg: so we win the !hA .... paulg: and finesse the club again ... paulg: both follow paulg: then we cash the !cA discarding our spade ... paulg: and both follow again paulg: so what do you want to do now? 1Valeria: !S ruff and J!H LoveBrdge: sp and trump nzakosek: !c paulg: these are the cards remaining babog: play another !C paulg: we have already made 1 heart and 3 clubs .... sceptic: and ruff club with high heart to get entry for your Q!H? paulg: so we need another four tricks ... sceptic: opps forget that someone played it :( tage2: !D paulg: so those who said ruff spade are correct .... paulg: let us make our small trump without danger ... 1Valeria: ruff with 2!H and wait to ruff something later with 7!H paulg: this will mean we have 5 tricks .... and hold !hJT97 ... paulg: and, as Valeria says, we shall always be able to make 3 tricks with this ollozzo (Lobby): hi ->ollozzo: hi paulg: this is the full hand .... paulg: if you fail to take the club finesse then you will go down ... not having enough winners paulg: if you take the heart finesse, you will do down as West will make the !hK, two heart ruffs, !sA and !dAK at least paulg: nzakosek suggested a spade instead of the !hQ ... paulg: ... this also means the contract will MAKE ... but it's not such a pretty line :) dwbva: as east -- when to takeout double and when to overcall 2!s? paulg: playing a spade at trick 2 is a SCISSORS PLAY paulg: as it cuts communications between West and East for the diamond ruffs paulg: so, some important points from this hand .... paulg: 1) count your tricks !! paulg: 2) Visualise the opponents hands from the bidding paulg: here you can see what West is likely to hold after the opening lead! babog: i got east west hands mixed up verg: what if they use an unknown system:-))) paulg: 3) Count your tricks again!! paulg: opponents will always tell you what they are playing bzstvn: or a tricky opening lead :-) paulg: if someone is good enough to make a tricky lead, then I never mind going wrong ... dwbva: merits of a 2!s overcall versus a takeout double? paulg: so a couple of people have asked about the East bidding ... paulg: so I'll ask everyone ..... paulg: who bids 2!s and who bids double? 1Valeria: DBL babog: id X robertn: 2!s bzstvn: dbl panim: x lonedar: x tage2: 2!S loubel: X verg: pass dwbva: 2!s seems cheaper, who wants to be in 3!c? tage2: Maybe to strong for 2!S verg: oh, sorry west passes Sherri: Dbl says 4, or poor 5 paulg: the passers need to be more aggressive ... and bid something on this hand :) sceptic: x isabable: 2s paulg: so I'd double for a couple of reasons .... bzstvn: sry. double is wrong... babog: its support for the other suits paulg: firstly I have shortage in the opening 2!h bid .... partner may have a penalty double as North passed Sherri: or strength, p doesn't want you to be able to pass? paulg: I have defensive tricks with two AKs paulg: my spade suit is poor ... no intermediates paulg: and I do have support for all three suits .... paulg: ... okay it's better for two of them but still playable in clubs paulg: so there is lots of upside in double ... that is, a lot of good things could happen paulg: whereas 2!s gives up on anything good :) paulg: perhaps the real bidding question is whether West should pass the double? 1Valeria: too risky dwbva: move one of east's heart spots to clubs, though... unpleasant 3!c contract? bzstvn: What respond do you expect if partner has a 3-4-3-3 shape? paulg: 5 trumps are good ... but they are small paulg: however if West leads diamonds then the contract goes down 2 for +500 ... 1Valeria: if I'd pass then lead !D to make aas many trumps as possible paulg: if West held a weak 3=4=3=3 I'd bid 2!s paulg: and expect East to pass paulg: there are no guarantees with the takeout double ... paulg: but I would expect all experts to bid that ... paulg: not all Wests would pass, but most would ... bzstvn: and how would you feel hearing 3!c? paulg: disappointed but would play okay ... paulg: i am ruffing hearts with the short trumps ... paulg: and i have !sAK and !dAK ... paulg: would expect to make ;) paulg: i have a simple view .... paulg: if you never concede -790 .... or similar scores ... paulg: then you are not doubling enough ... paulg: occasionally doubled contracts will make for a small score .... paulg: but by never doubling you will let the opposition off the hook too often paulg: the modern game is bidding aggressively ... paulg: ... this means more doubles .... panim: any liturature on doubling? paulg: did you see the European Championships last week ? panim: y paulg: two -3400s scores by international teams lolohudson: y babog: yes paulg: -2200 and lots of four figure penalties ... paulg: people bid a lot today ... and you need to be able to double them!! paulg: And, no-one plays penalty doubles anymore ... paulg: so that means lots of takeout doubles getting passed is the only way to get these penalties panim: when i get doubled, they score; when i double they make it and score as well ->panim: not sure bzstvn: Paul, I'm sure you're kidding. You wouldn't make 3!c, would you? rcbought: does the type of match affect how you should double? imps or mp? ->bzstvn: on this hand I'd expect West to bid 2!s rather than 3!c paulg: good question ... paulg: generally be more aggressive at matchpoints paulg: since you cannot score less than a bottom! verg: Paul, what will be the final bid of this hand if the 4 players were playing standard acol? verg: with strong 2s paulg: at matchpoints, opps making their contract undoubled may score very badly for you, so doubling them does not cost many matchpoints paulg: in standard Acol North would not pass 2!h ... but anyhow double is still takeout paulg: so that is it for this chat .... verg: tyPaul loubel: ?acol? panim: many thx babog: ty paul GalaxyI: tyvm Timbitt: tks Paul paulg: I am going back to the BIL now to review some of the hands from the BIL match kyno40: ty Paul Blanca17: thks Paul :))) philuser1: thx mentor paulg: BIL members are welcome to join us there :) loubel: i know.bu paulg: bye for now ACBL (Broadcast): !D!D!C!D!DSIGN UP NOW !D5min!D ACBL IMP SWISS Pairs !D5min!D SIGN UP NOW!!D!D!C!D!D sceptic: hi again paul paulg: re BILmanager (Lobby): => Club: !D paulg is continuing his session in the BIL now !D!D paulg: so before we play some unprepared hands .... I thought I'd just show how difficult it is to play this game at times paulg: I have two hands from the BIL match played on Saturday between some of us and the Precision class paulg: although I guess everyone is used to playing now ... paulg: ... playing teams gives you more things to worry about .... paulg: none of these are difficult ... but it just takes getting used to ... paulg: so I suggest you try playing team matches on here to get some practice paulg: in fact, we are planning on doing that on Mondays during August .... paulg: so, as most of you will be aware, wayne is used to having people watching him play ... paulg: but has less experience playing teams ... and combined with a new partner gave him the opportunity to forget the system paulg: so what would you open with the North hand? verg: 2NT panim: 2c thn->Kibitzers: !h Hi all friends, nice to see U all, I will listen carefull and in silence...from now !h lolohudson: 2clubs larstor: 2 cl babog: 2!C nzakosek: 2!c bzstvn: 2!c philuser1: 2 clubs 4 losers sceptic: 2!C kyno40: 2c bunnyj: 2c panim: 2n paulg: so this sequence shows 23-24 points, balanced .... lolohudson: 3 losers philuser1: 2 clubs 4 losers and not a good 2 NT paulg: a good description of this hand sceptic: small point does it not show 22 - 23 or 22 - 24? paulg: sorry, i'm told it shows 22-23 points :) panim: 2h transfer to spades and then 3n paulg: so what does 4!h show? 1Valeria: great fit !S kyno40: transfer to s paulg: 3!h is transfer to spades ... lolohudson: transfer to spades paulg: it makes no sense for the strong hand to transfer back :) sceptic: 4!H could show partner has forgotten it is a transfer to spades bzstvn: why doesn't N obey the transfer? panim: oops - 3h correction paulg: so 4!h could show that partner has forgotten ... but it actually shows ... paulg: great spade fit, and is a cuebid ... babog: unbalanced hand 1Valeria: in our system is Great !S fit with a problem in !H paulg: ok, that makes sense .... paulg: in my system it would show great !s fit, !hA and denies !dA and !cA paulg: in both our systems it would mean that south wants to signoff! paulg: of course, if North has forgotten the system ... then 4!s is a cuebid! babog: so does the 4!h need to be alerted then philuser1: what are the general conditions not to respect a xfer ? paulg: in most countries you do not alert bids above 3NT .... but in England you do paulg: not sure about Ireland babog: alert paulg: generally transfer breaks show very good fit paulg: south now knew that wheels had fallen off :) paulg: and tried to put an end to this auction ... paulg: North should really have passed this ... :) but was caught up in the excitement!! paulg: this contract did not make:) babog: so keep it simple works ->1Valeria: like to sit south ->sceptic: sit north! paulg: so we'll let wayne and valeria bid this hand ... and explain their version of Jacoby to us paulg: luckily we discussed this at last week's session before the match ->1Valeria: wayne's answering the doorbell! paulg->Kibitzers: hopefully they will bid 6!s ... 1Valeria: in the match he answered 3!C that means singleton i sign-off 4!S and he reopened ->sceptic: shall i roll it back? kyno40: 3s shows 18 + points philuser1: 3 hearts insteadof 2 spades i suppose sceptic: y Sherri: in this case is 4!C bid cue or Gerber? lolohudson: 2nt denies a major ->Sherri: cue bid, Sherri: ty paulg: 2NT is Jacoby .... it shows a game forcing raise in spades BWD1: 3!S paulg: and 3NT shows? kyno40: 15 to 17 1Valeria: very strong hand BILmanager->Kibitzers: !d Don't forget to use Control K when talking to kibbers--otherwise players can see your remarks !d sceptic: i dont remember exact hcp for bid :( 1Valeria: serious 3NT lovebrdge: strong no other 4card and no singleton kyno40: sorry sceptic: yes serious 3nt paulg: so when you play Jacoby you must agree what 3!s and 3NT mean .. ->sceptic: 5!c? ->sceptic: or 4NT? sceptic: no I should pass but I never last time ->sceptic: prob 4NT best ->sceptic: i think you should be in slam paulg: so this is an unfortunate slam that goes down on all leads except the !dA sceptic: cost us 13 imps i think :( paulg: there is a lot of duplication in the north-south hands .... paulg: but even so it is still a 50% slam ... so very reasonable to bid it kyno40: susan told us jajoby 2NT jump to 4=minimum 12 to 14 3NT 15 yo 17 3maj =18 + pints paulg: it did cost 13 IMPs when they never bid it in the other room ->kyno40: that's reasonable bzstvn: Who do precision players do with these hands? paulg: becuase East bid 2!d .... bzstvn: How... sceptic: so with non agressive pards in a team match you are best to play game not 50% slams paulg: the Precision players were able to have lots of asking bids after a 1!c opener dwbva: yes the other room had quite a fun precision auction Sherri: 3!S is standard isn't it to show 18+, ACBL teaches it that way, which is more common? ->Sherri: your way is more common .... this method is Italian Sherri: ty again paulg: the Precision players were able to discover more about the South hand paulg: and combined with a !d bid from East decided it was not worth bidding robertn: Precision auction starts 1C - 1S - 1NT(asking controls) paulg: the key to beating Precision is to bid a lot on these hands .... paulg: with my regular partner I would have bid with the East hand .... paulg: so the auction would have started .... paulg: (1!c)-2!s .... paulg: where 2!s shows either spades or three suits except spades paulg: i think robert and Oliver would probably have bid 6!s too then 1Valeria: ohhh beautiful paulg: anyhow ... paulg: we plan to have more matches between the classes in the future ... and also inter-class .. paulg: so watch out for these -- they are fun to play and watch ;) paulg: we have a little time left this evening ... so we'll just play some unprepared hands ... paulg: can I have two volunteers for West and East -- first to sit! sceptic: hiya everyone 1Valeria: hi :-) dwbva: hi ->sceptic: pass - no preference ->sceptic: or redouble - good hand :) sceptic: was bnot sure 1Valeria: typ sceptic: I have a loverly hand if we have a fit dwbva: thunder/lightning here -- apologies in advanced if I lose power here in the country ->sceptic: yes, redouble is probably best - it's Valeria who has overbid here although final contract ok dwbva: oops hallway (Lobby): Hi Paul :-) paulg: :) ->hallway: good morning philuser1: cede my seat to other volunteers ->dwbva: trump return was probably best dwbva: yeah ->philuser1: sit for two hands ... dwbva: stay or stand? ->dwbva: stay kyno40: very good bidding but bad play by opps. paulg: so the bidding was interesting .... philuser1: thx p perhaps i should have put the 8 of diamonds on your king, paulg: 3!c was fine, and wayne's double was clear ... paulg: i'd have bid 3!s with Valeria's hand :) bzstvn: Me, too... paulg: partner is in balancing seat and may not be very strong .... lovebrdge: i bid 3sp on dbl i have only 8 pts paulg: also 4333 is very poor shape babog: what did 4 !C mean panim: could she explain her 4c bid paulg: also if 4!c is undoubled then you will probably not get to your best fit when partner is 4-4 in the majors 1Valeria: I want wayne bid his major he may have 5!H panim: ok paulg: true he may have 5!h ... paulg: but when he has 4!s and 5!h then you probably want to play in the 4-4 fit ... paulg: 4!c is fine when you do not have a preference .... paulg: but it's generally best to show your hand and let him worry about his ... philuser1: 4 clubs redouble means p all colour are up to you to decide ? paulg: bidding is always difficult after a preempt ... paulg: so just try to show your hand ... paulg: wayne and I were discussing the redouble ... paulg: i think PASS shows no preference .... paulg: and REDOUBLE shows no preference but a good DOUBLE paulg: in case valeria was very strong too paulg: David could have made life more difficult by not leading the !cK ... dwbva: yes dwbva: more than difficult :-) paulg: but valeria could have cashed the !sQ and then you would have no choice! lovebrdge: yes sceptic: hi lolo 1Valeria: hi :-) dwbva: hi p ->lolohudson: thought of doubling? lolohudson: Hi David kyno40: can you open in 1st seat rule of 15 ? paulg->Kibitzers: who would bid 2!h and who would double with lolo's hand? ->kyno40: she has 19 - 9 HCPs and 6-4 suits babog->Kibitzers: 2!H Holty: double lovebrdge: i bid 2 hearts bzstvn->Kibitzers: Why not pass? geofspa->Kibitzers: I bid !h panim: 2h tage2->Kibitzers: 2 !H philuser1: honeymoon in afghanistan paulg: occasionally you'll see messages from kibs as I ask them questions and they forget to use Ctrl-K to reply:) Spikeren: dbl kyno40: i do not know the rule of 20 but maybe it will be in another lesson tage2: With 3 !C - maybe X ->dwbva: double bzstvn: 2!h is a bit risky, isn't it? tage2->Kibitzers: Sorry :-) geofspa: does IMP v MP make a difference to the over call ? sceptic: I hope so :) ->geofspa: not really dwbva: believe or not, I doubled then saw your comment :-) sceptic: glp lovebrdge: no 1 sp is risky ->dwbva: good! 1Valeria: typ bzstvn->Kibitzers: Both are risky :-) paulg->Kibitzers: Yes, I didn't offer pass as an option, but it is one - you are not forced to bid! lovebrdge: and 2 sp with 2 cards :-) rainbow63: Hi all. ->kyno40: what is rule of 15? panim: the distribution is not correct for a double bzstvn: I like pass :-) ->bzstvn: :) babog->Kibitzers: shud valeria open lolohudson: david is in a thunderstorm lovebrdge: I donot open with 2 aces is 2 tricks dwbva: re hi, sry bout these conn probs kyno40: in last seat points + s if it equ. 15 you bid 1s bzstvn->Kibitzers: I don't like this 1!s bid. I like pass. tage2: Is Pass the correct bid from W after 1!s ->kyno40: ok, but val in first position paulg: we'll discuss all the bids after the play paulg: well, the first 4 bids !!! babog->Kibitzers: 1!S shows better hand and 2!S is too strong sceptic: well we will keep the troops entertained I am sure tage2->Kibitzers: I agree babog lovebrdge: you never open 2 weak with 2 aces ->kyno40: so many people play rule of 20 to open ... that is add the number of HCP to the lengths of your longest two suits kyno40: thank you for telling me philuser1: according to bergen valeia has only 19 with jack of diamond stiff "shep" calls that a cquak ->kyno40: i'll tell everyone in a minute:) rainbow63: with 2 aces at only at the 1 level? paulg: well played val ... 1Valeria: ty :-) paulg: and well defended babog->Kibitzers: its not fair to the players if they see your chat folks Be Careful paulg: so let's look at the bidding paulg->Kibitzers: you can chat out loud now :) lolohudson: ok paulg: is Val's hand 1!s, 2!s or pass ... tage2: p babog: pass paulg: i dislike 2!s .... panim: p lolohudson: p lovebrdge: I wld pass sceptic: I prefer 2!S paulg: ... the hand has two aces and a poor suit ... two reasons not to open a weak two .. panim: does not meet the rule of 20 bzstvn: Pass paulg: i can live with either ONE reason but not both 1Valeria: vuln i'd pass but not vs vuln I open lolohudson: does not qualify for a preempt either paulg: so it is 1!s or Pass kyno40: p paulg: Most players will pass ... nzakosek: p paulg: I would open it 1!s ... but that is because I am an aggressive bidder ... kyno40: in 1st pos paulg: and I think both Val and Wayne would open this .... so at least they have a common style paulg: but pass would definitely be okay too sceptic: I dont think I would open anyweaker than this one bzstvn: I guess you like to be doubled :-) 1Valeria: aghhhh :-((( rainbow63: imho 2-card support is not good enough to raise 1 SDpade 1Valeria: not common style lol paulg: often you will see people talk about the Rule of 19 or Rule of 20 for opening bids lolohudson: y pass paulg: The Rule of 20 is recommended in the UK to people learning bridge ... paulg: Add the HCP in your hand .... paulg: ... to the lengths of the two longest suits paulg: so here, 9HCP + 6 spades + 4 clubs =19 paulg: so learners would not open this .... paulg: many experts play Rule of 19 ... so they would :) bzstvn: The j!d is worthless though, isn't it? ->bzstvn: yes philuser1->Kibitzers: you mean valeria is not a learner anymore paulg: although the !dJ is counted twice .... maruzol->Club: hay alguien que quiera jugar? lolohudson: ex[perts are very aggressive paulg: the favourable vulnerability would mean that I open ->lolohudson: yes, they are paulg: lois has a very difficult hand .... and there are three options .... Pass, Double and 2!h kyno40: that is you but us ? paulg: i think Rule of 20 is easier to handle .... paulg: I play a lot of very bad contracts using Rule of 19 lolohudson: my suit is not great but w/13HCCCCp I'll overcall paulg: it's ok to overcall but you must realise that it is dangerous ... sceptic: http://www.bridgeguys.com/Conventions/Ruleof19.html paulg: .... so sometimes you will lose a big penalty with a poor suit sceptic: http://www.bridgeguys.com/Conventions/Rule20.html paulg: and if you double then the 5th heart may get lost lolohudson: distribution not right for dbl?? bzstvn: This hand fails all the rules, because you practically have only 8 HCP. paulg: no the distribution is not good for double ... so it too is flawed lolohudson: why 8?? bzstvn: I mean 1Valeria's hand. ->bzstvn: time to move on from the opener! rainbow63: val 9 HCP lolohudson: y paulg: i may double, or bid 2!h, or pass - it's not clear! bzstvn: Ok. Sry, Paul. loubel: do experts use neg.X paulg: however I don't think much of Wayne's 2!s bid :) ->loubel: yes, all of them lolohudson: wrong dist for dbl is it not? Sherri->Kibitzers: i don't understand how it is dangerous to overcall 2!H's with 13 and to bid 4!S's with 15 pts between you ->lolohudson: yes, but do not be too worried about that Sherri->Kibitzers: is okay paulg: wayne's 2!s really shows 3-card support ... paulg: and he is probably best worth a pass and wait for partner to reopen ... paulg: then he can bid 2!s (if Val doubles) to show 2-card support, or bid 3!c paulg: so David also has options ... paulg: and actually I think 4!h is wrong .... he is too strong panim: does Wayne have the points to bid at the 3 level? paulg: 4!h is best used as a preempt or distributional raise paulg: so with 2 aces I would cuebid spades and then support hearts ... paulg: to show a VALUE raise to 4!h ... paulg: this tells Lois that Valeria and Wayne are sacrificing ... it is East-West's hand paulg: it is important to use the space available in the auction when you have good hands ... 1Valeria: 3!D ? should show good suit and may be 3 cards support ? paulg: ... and consume space when you have bad hands ->1Valeria: standard would just be diamonds, forcing 1 round lolohudson: doesn't 3 spades show a limit raise in hearts? paulg: well, 3!s is forcing to game so limit/value mean the same thing here paulg: the key thing is that it is not a preemptive or weak raise lolohudson: y nzakosek: limit/value? paulg: your hand is not interested in slam anyhow ... but you would double 4!s because 5!h may be unsafe paulg: as you have no aces glenlyon: why not 3 d's lolohudson: I assumed limit not value ->nzakosek: values = good raise, with high card points ->glenlyon: you are likely to have a 6-3 fit ... and partner may get confused by 3!d in pickup game glenlyon: ty paulg: val's final 4!s bid is reasonable as this looks like a good save against 4!h ... presuming partner has 3+ spades! paulg: here wayne and val are VERY lucky that they have a club fit .. without this they could lose -800 or more! paulg: so that's it for tonight .... lolohudson: thx for the game sceptic: thx paul :) good luck in US 1Valeria: thank you so much :-) LP_15_: is this seat was someone? kyno40: Thank you Paul paulg: i;d like to thank wayne and valeria and our other volunteers lovebrdge: ty panim: thank you very much - excellent explanations paulg: the fun with valeria and wayne is that they do bid like experts ... at times ;) kyno40: as always babog: thanks Paul paulg: i'm off for the next two weeks as I'm playing in New York in the US Nationals ... panim: lots of luck paulg: but the newsletter will keep you up to date with the next sessions nzakosek: good luck babog: Best of Luck sceptic: good luck Paul 1Valeria: good luck :-)) BILmanager: !D!D Paul-thank you so much lovebrdge: gl paulg: ty - need to learn how to alert in American now! kyno40: GOOD LUCK PAUL and come home with the bacon paulg: bye all - see you soon :) yoffy: ty=toda